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Confined Space Fatalities…an updated look at the numbers

Thursday, September 2, 2021

Ten years ago we published a review of the statistics from the Census of Fatal Occupational Injuries in confined spaces. How have the stats changed over the years?

We were surprised to find that confined space fatalities have increased in recent years.

Annual CS Falalities_2011-18The 2011 to 2018 average was 128 deaths per year, up from 96 in 2005-2009, and the trend was a consistent increase from 2013 through 2017. Only one state (Rhode Island) experienced no confined space fatalities during this period. This is yet another notable increase, as only 28 states recorded fatalities in 2005-2009.

CS Fatalities by Activity_2011-18The construction industry again took the lead for most fatalities, but it’s important to note that more fatalities occurred during repairs and maintenance than during construction or dismantling (226 vs 193).

In a repeat from our prior analysis, atmospheric hazards were not the biggest cause of fatalities. It was again the Physical Hazards that topped the chart, with “Contact with Objects and Equipment” being the largest set of causes.

CS Fatalities by Event_2011-18This Physical Hazards area includes:

  • Struck by = 106
    • 61 of those were falling objects
  • Caught in = 82
  • Collapses = 294
    • 168 of those were Trench/Excavation fatalities, 135 being in the private construction industry

In comparison, there were 165 deaths from inhalation of a harmful substance and/or oxygen deficiency (excluding drownings) and another 165 deaths from falls. This means that these three hazards account for almost half of the 1,030 deaths during this 8-year period.

Trench Collapses, Atmospheric Hazards, and Falls account for half of all Confined Space* related fatalities from 2011-2018.

These numbers serve to remind us of how important safety precautions and training are when working around confined spaces. As rescuers, we routinely focus on atmospheric hazards. However, these statistics show we must be aware of the many physical hazards that confined spaces so often include.

*Note that CFOI’s definition of a confined space may differ from the OSHA definition.

Data and images are excerpts from Roco Rescue’s presentation at the VPPPA 2021 Safety+ National Symposium.

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Additional Resources

 

 

Small-town Department, Big-time Hazards

Monday, August 23, 2021

Many small-town fire departments often have their share of big-time hazards, but perhaps none fits that bill like the Westlake Fire Department in Southwest Louisiana. This department, located on the I-10 industrial corridor, is surrounded by some of the largest petrochemical plants in the nation, and it’s growing daily. And, while maybe small in number, this department must be ready for some of the most diverse hazards possible – many with huge implications for their community.

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Westlake firefighters respond to a house fire in Myrtle Springs (photo courtesy WFD)

Winner of Roco's LFCA Training Course Giveaway

With that said, we are extremely proud to have awarded the Westlake Fire Department with FREE Roco training as the winner of our Urban/Industrial Rescue Essentials™ Course Giveaway at the Louisiana Fire Chiefs Association (LFCA) annual conference. This course giveaway affords us the opportunity to offer life-saving training while showing our support for all of the hard work that first responders do every day to serve their communities.

We recently sat down with Westlake Fire Department’s Assistant Fire Chief, Jimmy Boyette, to learn a little more about their operation, what drives them and how Roco’s confined space and high angle rescue training can benefit them. Check out our conversation below.


Roco: First, tell us more about your department…what is the makeup of your organization and what sort of emergencies are you responsible for covering?

Westlake FD: Westlake Fire is made up of one Fire Chief, two Assistant Fire Chiefs, three Shift Captains, three Shift Lieutenants, and (when fully staffed) six Firefighters. We are also currently working with the city and our Fire Board to secure more staff members to better assist our rapidly growing area. We respond to the City of Westlake and the surrounding areas (Ward 4, Fire District 3) in Calcasieu Parish. We run fire, rescue, medical, and HAZMAT emergencies in our extremely industrial area.

Roco: Currently, how often does your department conduct training?

Westlake FD: We train three days a month at the Calcasieu training center. We try to stick with a theme or concentration, such as car extraction, medical help, etc. We encourage anyone who shows interest to attend, although it’s hard when there are only seven spots and all 15 of our members want to go!

Roco: What are some of the specific hazards that your department faces and what technical rescue incidents could they pose?

Westlake FD: Our city is surrounded by industry, which presents many potential confined space and high angle scenarios for our department. The multi-billion-dollar Sasol plant expansion took place, essentially, in our backyards – and that is just one of the plants that is local to our area. In our response area also lies the Isle of Capri Casino high-rise construction project along with numerous apartment complexes with more on the way. Then, we have the I-10 Calcasieu River bridge, which poses a continuous hazard for the thousands of travelers on I-10 each day. Add in a passenger rail train, and the fact that we are surrounded on three sides by water – all come with their own unique opportunities for varying types of rescue disciplines.

Roco: Because you are located in such a highly industrialized area, do you have a mutual aid agreement with other agencies? How does that work?

Westlake FD: We are a part of the Southwest LA Mutual Aid Association, which is a large agreement between municipalities and industries to help provide HAZMAT and supplies outside of normal capabilities when needed. Any entity of the association can call upon another member for resources in time of a major disaster or event. When manpower or resources are lacking, members can step in and help each other. The organization meets monthly to keep a pulse on what members and local businesses are doing and how we may be able to partner together.

Roco: Ideally, how many department personnel would you like to be trained in confined space and high angle rescue? Why do your members join the rescue team?

Westlake FD: Because we are a small department, we would like to see everyone rescue trained, but so many still need the right training in order for that to happen. Those who serve on the rescue team generally have a passion for going above and beyond to serve the community. Many of them have generational ties to first responders, and a number of our team members previously served in the military. A common theme we see is that our members want to serve their community after serving their country.

“A common theme we see is that our members want to serve their community after serving their country.”

Roco: What made you seek this training grant from Roco Rescue?

Westlake FD: Our city is in the process of recovering from not only the global pandemic taking an economic toll on nearly all sources of funding (like everyone else), but also a near-direct hit from two back-to-back hurricanes; a once-in-a-generation freeze; and, more recently, the floods that impacted Southwest Louisiana. All of this coming during an already difficult financial recovery due to mismanagement by a previous administration that almost left the city bankrupt. As a result, we are constantly searching to find and take advantage of all sources of free training. For example, we currently use the Lake Charles Fire Academy as an initial training for new employees. The majority of our members have a basic understanding of confined space/rope rescue techniques, but we believe having some (if not all of them) partake in more advanced training will help us flatten the learning curve. We also have a Captain and Assistant Chief who are previous graduates of Roco Rescue – and they have had nothing but great things to say about the level of training and experience of instructors at Roco; their reputation is unmatched.

“Our department leaders have had nothing but great things to say about the level of training and experience of instructors at Roco; their reputation is unmatched.”

Roco: Final question, what makes your team work well together?

Westlake Fire DepartmentWestlake FD: Being small, everyone knows everyone. We fully encompass a total family atmosphere – we don’t just know each other, but we also know each other’s families. Westlake has a big-town feel but it is really a small-town attitude.

“We really encompass a total family atmosphere – we don’t just know each other, but we also know each other’s families.”


Roco applauds the hard work and dedication that every member of the Westlake Fire Department continues to show their community, and we are honored to train alongside this team. They recognized a need for more in-depth training and refused to back down until a solution was found. Assistant Fire Chief Jimmy Boyette stated, “We are in the heart of the industrial area of Lake Charles, which means a special operations division within our department is an absolute must.”

Is OSHA VPP a Good Fit for Your Company?

Thursday, August 12, 2021

VPP-logoThe short answer…. of course, it is! Whether you are a large company or a small company (like ours), we have experienced that VPP can be a “win-win-win” for all who participate. The collaboration between employers, employees, and OSHA is one of the most refreshing aspects of VPP participation.


By bringing those three groups together to determine any areas that can enhance worker safety, and do so with a team spirit, is not only effective but also goes a very long way in building a trusting rapport.

It’s important to note that OSHA VPP is a voluntary program, and that is the first hint that the entire process is based on a triad of cooperation and support. Therefore, with the VPP process, the first thing you need to remember is that OSHA is here to help you. No, really…in our VPP experience, there has been one example after another of OSHA representatives being very helpful and supportive throughout the process. Ultimately, this has created a safer workplace and enhanced the safety culture of our company. More on that in a bit.

No doubt, there’s a lot of upfront effort in preparing for your first onsite VPP audit. OSHA realizes that the initial onsite audit and the self-evaluation package are not easy or quick “blink-of-the-eye” efforts. However, OSHA makes it less daunting by helping to arrange for a “mentor VPP company” to assist new applicant companies. These VPP volunteers act as mentors throughout the preparation process.

Roco Rescue VPP Elements

For starters, any company seeking entry into the VPP program must have a very safe OSHA-compliant workplace with all the programs expected of VPP in place. The applicant must be able to demonstrate compliance with the four main VPP Elements and all the sub-elements, which are quite extensive. In addition, continuous safety improvement is a never-ending focus with VPP.Download the Roco Rescue Safety Improvement Cycle Poster

To address all VPP elements and sub-elements takes a fair amount of effort and understanding of how best to put into words a narrative description of your safety and health programs. Then, you must be able to tie it to the documentation that backs it up. There is a high potential for a shortfall or disconnect between what OSHA is looking for and what you think they are looking for, and that happened to us on our first audit. It wasn’t a major factor, but it was enough to cause the audit team to call a time out on the process and give us some appropriate guidance and time to revise that particular sub-element to meet the requirements of the program. It was more a matter of semantics than execution, but the point is, the OSHA team cooperated with, and supported us. Ultimately, we were awarded our VPP Star status at the conclusion of that audit.

Earlier I referred to a triad of cooperation and support, but all I have mentioned so far is OSHA and the employer. So, who makes up the third point of the triad? That would be the employees. The four elements of VPP are very clear – not only is management leadership a very big part of the program, but as importantly, so is employee involvement – the third point of the triad!

We’ve found that one of the greatest benefits of participating in the VPP program is how it gets all the employees involved. For a safety culture to evolve in a workplace, it is an absolute must that the employees have a stake in their own safety and the safety of others around them. To have any feeling of ownership, or having a stake in the success of the program, employees must not only feel that their input matters, but the program must include employee input not just as a mindset, but that it is demonstrable through documentation.

One of the most beneficial outcomes of employee involvement is the development of programs that don’t just sound good on paper, but actually work in application.

By asking employees for their ideas on how best to make their area not only meet the requirements of the program, but to make it a usable, and most importantly an effective tool or strategy – and who better to hear this from than the person(s) that will be implementing the tool? By allowing the employees to come up with solutions for providing for their own safety in concert with management support and leadership, we are finding that the safety culture, as well as the overall safety of the workplace, has been greatly enhanced.

So how does participation in the VPP program help you as a company? Out of all the programs, growth, changes, new classes, equipment, facility additions and other significant events that I have witnessed over the past 20+ years with Roco Rescue, the teamwork and communication between employees and management was never as dynamic as it has been due to our participation in VPP.

The VPP flag flying at the Roco Rescue Training Center.
The VPP flag proudly displayed at the Roco Rescue Training Center adds emphasis to our company motto, “There’s a safe way and a SAFER way!”

Roco has always placed safety first and our motto, “There’s a Safe Way, and a Safer Way!” has always rung true in our day-to-day business. But even with such a strong record of safety before VPP, it is clear that our workplace safety has gotten much stronger and that is due primarily to our work with OSHA VPP. The program has provided the tool for our management team; and, most importantly, our employees to develop new and safer practices and programs.

I mentioned VPP being a win-win-win situation earlier. I think it is clear how the employer and employees benefit from participation in VPP, but one of the benefits to OSHA is witnessing innovative safety practices and how those practices result in measurable safety benefits. To illustrate this, I want to share a story from one of the onsite VPP evaluations I assisted with as an SGE.

During the visit, the OSHA evaluation team learned of a monitoring program for companies that use forklifts and lift trucks as part of their daily activities. This monitoring system consisted of hardware and software that monitors vehicle speed, any impacts in a selectable value or G force, maintenance and inspection status, and other criteria. The company had seen a 90% reduction in the costs associated with forklift and lift truck maintenance and materiel damage associated with these types of operations. This reduction does not include any costs that would be a result of injury or fatality. The overall reduction in over-speed and impact incidents should directly correlate with any injury or fatality potential. This is an example of an OSHA benefit in collecting best-known practices (BKM) and sharing that BKM with other companies.

Now all this being said, it is by no means a given that simply applying for OSHA VPP participation and undergoing an onsite evaluation will result in your company receiving recognition in any of the three VPP programs – Star, Merit, or Demonstration. But remember, VPP is a cooperative effort, and this means that any shortfalls in your safety program or performance will be clearly identified.

Written evaluation reports will be given that provide a great roadmap to help you not only make corrections to achieve VPP recognition, but most importantly to provide a safer, healthier, and ultimately a more profitable workplace.

So, is the OSHA VPP program a good fit for your company? From our experience, we feel very strongly that it is a good fit for any company. In addition, there are many more benefits to participation in VPP than what we covered in this article including preferred consideration by clients who also value a safety focus. However, for Roco, the most important has been the enhanced safety throughout our operations and the companywide buy-in from our employees and support from management.

HERE'S MORE...

What is VPP?

The OSHA Voluntary Protection Program (VPP) promotes effective worksite-based safety and health. In the VPP, management, labor, and OSHA establish cooperative relationships at workplaces that have implemented a comprehensive safety and health management system. Approval into VPP is OSHA’s official recognition of the outstanding efforts of employers and employees who have achieved exemplary occupational safety and health.

How Has VPP Improved Worker Safety & Health?

Statistical evidence for VPP’s success is impressive. The average VPP worksite has a Days Away Restricted or Transferred (DART) case rate of 52% below the average for its industry. These sites typically do not start out with such low rates. Reductions in injuries and illnesses begin when the site commits to the VPP approach to safety and health management and the challenging VPP application process.

How Does VPP Benefit Employers?

Fewer injuries and illnesses mean greater profits as workers’ compensation premiums and other costs plummet. Entire industries benefit as VPP sites evolve into models of excellence and influence practices industry-wide.

How Can I Get More Information?

For more information, visit https://www.osha.gov/vpp or download Roco's Continuous Safety Improvement Cycle poster with details about each of the four elements of VPP.

About the Author: Pat Furr has recently retired from Roco and is currently “living the dream” in New Hampshire. He was a chief instructor, technical consultant, VPP Coordinator, and Corporate Safety Officer for Roco for many years. As a chief instructor, he taught a wide variety of technical rescue classes including Fall Protection, Rope Access, Tower Work/Rescue and Suspended Worker Rescue. In his role as technical consultant, he was involved in research and development, writing articles, and presenting at national conferences. Prior to joining Roco in 2000, Pat served 20 years in the US Air Force as a Pararescueman (PJ).

Roco Reviews the New CMC Triskelion™ Tripod

Wednesday, July 21, 2021
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Triskelion. The name is as old as the concept, three legs coming together to a common point and sharing a load concentrated in the center of those three legs. There are numerous examples of the tripod in Greek, Chinese and Roman history. When it evolved into a design that could be moved, adjusted where needed, and used to create an overhead anchor, we started paying attention. Fast forward a millennium and the concept really has not changed. In the world of work and rescue, we are still picking things up and putting them down using tripods. 

The most common tripod is the rectangular leg design that is popular with work crews covering a multitude of industries. Usually there is a bracket mounted on one leg to accept a cable winch and a couple of head-mounted pulleys in line to run that cable over. This keeps the resultant forces within the footprint and makes them very stable when loaded properly. They are designed to support a single user with a maximum capacity of 310 lbs. and WLL (working load limit) of 350 lbs. The legs are adjustable in height and come with a chain hobble. Workers all over the world are hanging below these tripods as you read this. 

With the new Triskelion™ Industrial Rescue Tripod, CMC has taken that rectangle tube leg design and utilized it for rescue. If your rules of engagement require NFPA compliance with your equipment, you will be pleased to know that the Triskelion is the first industrial rescue tripod to receive an NFPA General Use rating. 

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Roco recently got a chance to put our hands on one and put it through some testing and team reps with a couple of progressive fire departments in Idaho and New Mexico, as well as at the Roco Training Center in Baton Rouge. Firefighters can be tough on gear, but right out of the box they commented on its look and solid feel. Once in use, it didn’t take us long to discover that rescuers wanted to get their hands on the Triskelion as soon as possible. 

We beat it up, we used it hard and rough, and it performed – it really performed. When loading it as a traditional tripod with a block and tackle, it locks in tight. It locks into a never-moving position like a 35-year-old living in his parents’ basement, playing Clash of Clans. He is not moving, and neither is the Triskelion. When the Triskelion is loaded correctly, it is incredibly stable. It is also incredibly quiet. For those who spend any time using work tripods, you are already familiar with that cringe-worthy feeling you get hearing the tripod creak and grind as it hopefully settles into a strong supportive position. The Triskelion is a touch more stoic. It stands up strong and keeps its mouth shut. 

Despite its robust size, the Triskelion is smooth in its operation. If the CMC crew wants to send over the names of the brilliant engineering team members who set the pin location on the legs, we can find the time to buy them a round of drinks. With its new design, we think it’s the best on the market. The rectangular legs are set up with stoppers so that whether you are all the way down, or all the way extended, the pinholes are lined up. Such a simple feature, but one that quickly became a favorite of the Roco teams that used it. 

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The tethered pins are big and user-friendly with ball-locks, but with big pins come big holes so be careful you don’t slip a finger into one while adjusting! Graphics and adjustment markers on the legs are bold and easy to see, making coordination a breeze. The days of struggling to pin the legs at height are over. 

The head-mounted pulleys are low profile and well protected. We used one of them rigged with one of our favorite Tripod systems to perform a shaft rescue (think English Reeve without the track lines and control lines). 

The low profile of the pulley and the elimination of swing from not having to hang a pulley on both sides created a very compact and stable shaft system. The low-profile system also provides additional headspace when bringing out a vertical litter. 

Roco Rescue | Vertical Sked litter raise with CMC Triskelion tripodA group in an open enrollment Roco class in Baton Rouge used the Triskelion to bring up a vertical Sked and had over a foot of clearance left when the feet cleared due to the increased headspace. And just in case you didn’t get all your rigging right before you raised the Triskelion to its 10ft. maximum height, the optional footsteps ensure you can still reach to add, change, or delete anything you need. CMC also offers winch mounting solutions for the excellent Harkin Lokhead winch as well as DBI/Sala offerings. 

The storage bag is reinforced on each end and features sewn handles for a two-person carry. There is also a padded shoulder strap, which you will appreciate if trying to carry alone. The straps are offset towards the head to compensate for the extra weight the Triskelion carries up top. 

Special thanks to the City of Nampa Fire Department and Albuquerque Fire Rescue for contributing and providing feedback. Many of us came into this evaluation thinking, “how good can it be?” and we finished by asking, “when can we get one?”

If you are interested in purchasing the new Triskelion Tripod, you can order from our online store, call us at (800) 647-7626, or order via email at info@RocoRescue.com.ROC003-July-Social-v1roco-fb-insta-4

Sked Stretcher...Celebrating 40 Years and Still the Best!

Thursday, June 24, 2021

Few rescue devices have saved more lives than the Sked Stretcher – and it’s literally saved thousands of lives. And, after almost 40 years, it’s still the most compact, versatile stretcher on the market. In reality, it has become a staple item in rescue that is used by thousands of emergency responders around the globe including the U.S. military.

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Roco recently talked with the owners of Skedco to get a little more history on this unique rescue system. According to Bud Calkin, “Skedco has been on a lifesaving mission since 1981 – and while there have been numerous improvements to the Sked over the years, it is still a simple, effective tool for rescuers.” Co-owner Catherine Calkin adds, “Skedco is definitely all about supporting emergency responders, both civilian and military. We’re also about providing a good place to work for our employees. People depend on us; we can’t let them down.”

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We asked a number of questions about the origins of the Sked stretcher as well as how the device is produced, tested and used in the field. Here’s more of our discussion…

Roco: Of course, the first question is how many Sked stretchers do you estimate that you've made over the years? And, how many rescues?

Skedco: Way over a half-million; we produce and ship thousands every year to places around the world. There’s no way to know exactly how many rescues have been performed with the Sked, but we estimate in the thousands.

Roco: What's a day like at Skedco with the manufacturing of the Sked?

Skedco: Busy. We try to have at least 500 standard and HMH Skeds ready to box up and ship at all times. We never know when different governments will place big orders; and, of course, they always expect very prompt shipping. But having these in stock also means that other customers get the same quick shipping times.

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Roco: What gave you the idea for the Sked stretcher?

Skedco: After struggling with all types of rescue litters in the Army and wanting to evacuate a wounded soldier over long distances by myself, I eventually redesigned a game carrier invented by my sister for dragging a deer from the point of kill. After extensive research on plastics and other materials, I built the first Sked. I drew the design around a very heavy guy, and it has never changed – although there are several variations now and I am close to fielding one more for the military.

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Roco: How long did the research and development of the Sked take?

Skedco: Considering the evolution and expansion of capabilities, it was about 5 years. We made changes as needs appeared along the way. Today, there are 8 versions of Sked.

Roco: What makes the Sked so perfect for rescue?

Skedco: Its compactness, versatility, durability and ease of use.

Roco: How do you test the Sked?

Skedco: There were a number of tests that I did on the Sked including “cold crack” testing to
minus 120 degrees; pull testing on the grommets in the plastic; drop-testing; environmental testing of the plastic; chemical absorption testing of the plastic; and pull-testing of all sewn webbing. And I myself was inside the stretcher during in-use field testing of all functions. I felt that if it wasn’t safe for me, then I could not trust the device for others. I had to have faith in the product, or I wouldn’t have produced it.

Roco: What type of plastic is used in making the Sked? And how strong is it?

Skedco: The Sked is made from a proprietary formula of E-Z glide polyethylene plastic. This plastic can withstand temperatures as low as minus 120 degrees without becoming brittle. It has proven to be tough enough to withstand being run over by a 56-ton tank – and then used to drag a soldier around a military base over extremely rough terrain for more than 10 miles! The greatest weight we've heard a Sked carrying was a 1,347 lb. individual. What’s more, there was no damage to the Sked afterward.

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Roco: How is the military version of the Sked different from the civilian version?

Skedco: The military has its own unique specifications for the Sked. It is designed specifically for the battlefield. This includes more subdued coloring; and, in some cases, the stretcher is narrower and shorter for extremely tight spaces and for carrying long distances when size is a problem. However, the plastic material is the same as the civilian version.

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Roco: What is the most unique rescue that has been performed using a Sked stretcher?

Skedco: I think the most unusual and demanding rescue was the cave rescue in Thailand a couple of years ago when 12 kids and their soccer coach were rescued. Nobody thought it could be done but they finally got permission to proceed. The Air Force Pararescue guys out of Okinawa and the Thai Navy Seals performed the rescue. There was an Australian anesthesiologist who mixed the drug combination so the boys could be kept sedated during each rescue evolution. This rescue operation required hundreds of people for support including staging and maintenance of equipment, pumping water from parts of the cave, rigging of rope systems, searching for the boys and providing food and water for the boys. It was a massive effort, and a huge success – we are grateful to have played a role.

Roco: Speaking of water rescue applications, what makes up this specialized version?

Skedco: There is a special floatation system for using the stretcher in water. The system is designed to keep the Sked upright in water. If it gets capsized, it will self-right. Patient packaging in the water takes as little as 20 seconds by only one person.

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Roco: Do you ever hear from patients who have been rescued using a Sked?

Skedco: Very seldom; but when I do, I get some of the most bizarre stories about it!

Roco: How has the Sked improved over the years?

Skedco: There have been many improvements and additions to the original Sked stretcher. Examples include a flotation system, spinal immobilization, better ropes, carabiners, webbing and carrying bag. For the Hazmat/hospital version, I used polypropylene webbing and military-grade plastic side-release buckles for safety in chemical environments. The newer Sked units include Austrian-made Skedco/Cobra side-release buckles, which are extremely strong and durable – and much easier to use.

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Roco: What are your thoughts about the future of the Sked stretcher? Any changes or revisions anticipated?

Skedco: As a matter of fact, I am currently designing 2 new Skeds for the military. Final testing will be done within the next few months.

Roco: What are your thoughts about the future of technical rope rescue?

Skedco: There will always be a need for Technical Rope Rescue – because people continue to get themselves into the most difficult places and in the most dangerous environments. Many times, there are injuries with desperate need of medical care. Thankfully, there are special people who will risk their own lives to save them from these deadly situations; and there are companies like Roco who do the training for those dangerous events.


Roco salutes the entire Skedco team for their many years of service as they approach their 40th anniversary later this year. We also asked what makes it all worthwhile – the many long hours, the never-ending testing and the continuing advancements to the Sked. Founder Bud Calkin stated, “It’s simple. We are extremely privileged to be able to provide a specialized tool needed to perform oftentimes extreme rescues and to know so many hundreds of rescue personnel from around the world who risk their lives on a regular basis to save others. To borrow a phrase from US Air Force Pararescue, ‘That others may live.’ After all, isn't that what it’s all about?”

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